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Date:	12/13/99 4:29:10 PM Pacific Standard Time<BR>
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Traveller-digest     Monday, December 13 1999     Volume 1999 : Number 1488<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Starting Traveller Newbies, Handouts<BR>
SEC: UNCLASSIFIED Dragon Magazine Article on CD ROM<BR>
Re: GT Nobles<BR>
Re: South Park's Cartman as a Imperial Noble<BR>
Re: Paintball and morality (was Re: OT/Flamebait ...)<BR>
Re: Deserts<BR>
Re: Starting Traveller Newbies, Handouts<BR>
Re: Traveller News Service<BR>
Re: Traveller News Service<BR>
Re: Wearable Lawyers (was Re: Deserts)<BR>
Re: Deserts<BR>
Re: Traveller News Service<BR>
Re: Salvage<BR>
Re: Deserts (getting very OT)<BR>
Re: Deserts<BR>
Re: Deserts<BR>
RE:  GURPS Aliens (not GT Alien Races) in Traveller<BR>
Jackie Chan can whip Virus any day.<BR>
Re: Mass communication, the nobility and epistemology (LONG)<BR>
Christmas and snow.<BR>
Re: Mass communication, the nobility and epistemology (LONG)<BR>
Re: Deserts<BR>
Re: Mass communication, the nobility and epistemology (LONG)<BR>
Re: Nobility<BR>
Re:  GURPS Aliens (not GT Alien Races) in Traveller<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 08:31:46 +1100<BR>
From: "Jim & Peta Lawrie" <jimpeta@primus.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Starting Traveller Newbies, Handouts<BR>
<BR>
<Snip><BR>
>One of the best systems for handouts was Warhammer FRP particularly the<BR>
>Enemy Within Campaign. These adventures contained lots of letters, maps and<BR>
>clues that the PC's collect during the adventures. Some of the handouts<BR>
>contained obscure clues that would only make sense further along in the<BR>
>campaign, the players have to reference back to older handouts to follow<BR>
the<BR>
>entire plot (it was entirely possible to play the adventures and suceed and<BR>
>never work out what was really going on).<BR>
<Snip><BR>
>J.<BR>
<BR>
    Call of Cthulhu must be the undiputed kings of the handout world, which<BR>
is just great if you lose one of 26 handouts and you want to run the<BR>
scenario in another 10 years. I recommend zip-lok bags stapled to the book.<BR>
One of the things that PCs seem to really like is a nice map, NASA has some<BR>
fantastic pics that can easily be altered to fit the game and printed. A bit<BR>
of Technish print layed over the top and it really adds to the game and the<BR>
pics quite often suggest little ideas that spice the world up.<BR>
    Jim L.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 08:37:15 +1100<BR>
From: "Hughes, Michael" <Michael.Hughes@cbr.defence.gov.au><BR>
Subject: SEC: UNCLASSIFIED Dragon Magazine Article on CD ROM<BR>
<BR>
Issue number 88 (?)had, in the Ares Sci Fi section, ENHANCED Rogue character<BR>
generation. One of the better articles IMHO. <BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Michael Hughes<BR>
Knowledge Edge Engagement Policy  & US/NZ Team<BR>
International Policy Division<BR>
Australian Defence Headquarters<BR>
Australian Department of Defence<BR>
<BR>
Phone (B): (02) 6265 6112<BR>
Phone (H): (02) 6296 1055<BR>
Fax:       (02) 6265 7225<BR>
Email: michael.hughes@cbr.defence.gov.au<BR>
<mailto:michael.hughes@cbr.defence.gov.au> <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 12 Dec 1999 21:47:09 +0100<BR>
From: Volker Greimann <volker@greimann.de><BR>
Subject: Re: GT Nobles<BR>
<BR>
Another thing that would be great to see, is the change of he nobilities <BR>
status from M:0 till M:GT (if any). I would think being a duke on a <BR>
recently integrated world means something entirely different than being a <BR>
noble of a fief settled a long time ago.<BR>
Also, along the same line, it would be great to see some lineages of old <BR>
established families, what happened to their leaders at crucial times of <BR>
Imperial History, etc.<BR>
Just my .02 Cr. <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 12 Dec 1999 21:48:44 +0100<BR>
From: Volker Greimann <volker@greimann.de><BR>
Subject: Re: South Park's Cartman as a Imperial Noble<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
>Cartman is clearly Lucan.<BR>
><BR>
><Cartman voice> I'm the emperor! Respect my authori-ty! </Cartman voice><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
>I would compare Stan to Archduke Norris, but I am trying to purge the <BR>
>thought of Norris vomiting whenever approached by a future Archduchess.<BR>
And Kenny would be Brzk, I guess. I mean, who can really understand an <BR>
Imperial Vargr, right?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 10:43:02 +1300<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: Paintball and morality (was Re: OT/Flamebait ...)<BR>
<BR>
On 12 Dec 99, at 20:28, Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Oddly enough, Jesse deGraf and I have just returned from visiting Mark<BR>
> Cook in Oregon, where we had the pleasure of attending a full-auto shoot<BR>
> at his gun club.  Coming from California with a fairly strict level of gun<BR>
> control, going 450 miles to find privately owned .50 calibre machine guns<BR>
> a shock.  A *pleasant* shock, but a shock.  <BR>
<BR>
I am sooo envious. There are a few full-auto collectors clubs here, but <BR>
they actually get to fire their guns very seldom (you need to be on an <BR>
Army range, with special permission from the police, etc, etc), and the <BR>
meets are very poorly publicised.<BR>
<BR>
Ob Trav: How many Travellers, other than the PCs, go to low Law Level <BR>
worlds just to use/purchase weapons they normally aren't allowed?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Rupert Boleyn <paradise.net.nz><BR>
Wellington, New Zealand<BR>
<BR>
A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 22:52:27 +0100 (MET)<BR>
From: Tommy Grav <tommy.grav@astro.uio.no><BR>
Subject: Re: Deserts<BR>
<BR>
On Tue, 14 Dec 1999, Jim & Peta Lawrie wrote:<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
>>> I hate Christmas without snow!  :(<BR>
>><BR>
>>There is no Christmas witou snow, so there!<BR>
>>Tommy Grav<BR>
><BR>
>    You obviously meant to say "There is no christmas without 35 degreeC<BR>
>weather, kookaburra's or VB beer."<BR>
>    Jim L.<BR>
<BR>
Ohh no! There is no Christmas without a meter of snow, -25C and a clear <BR>
night sky. A real Norwegian Christmas, yeeeeeessssss. I'll be going up into<BR>
the mountains this Christmas and I'm really looking forward to it.<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
><BR>
><BR>
<BR>
Tommy Grav<BR>
- -------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
tommy.grav@astro.uio.no     http://www.uio.no/~tommygr/  <BR>
Institute of Astrophysics, UiO, No  <BR>
IMTU tn++t4+tg+ ru+ge++ !3i jt+au+st+ls hi++dr-so++zh-sy-sw++ <BR>
 <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 16:53:54 -0500<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Starting Traveller Newbies, Handouts<BR>
<BR>
From: Jonathan Lupton <jonathanlupton@hotmail.com><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> TSR went through a phase of producing "flip books" for their Dark<BR>
>Sun adventures. The adventure came with a book of pictures to<BR>
>show the players  at specified points during the adventure.<BR>
>Unfortunately TSR made a few  mistakes (Jungle pictures in a desert<BR>
>scene, giving the plot away at the  start of the adventure etc.) and the<BR>
>idea was dropped.<BR>
<BR>
The idea is a bit older than that. TSR did it with Tomb of Horrors and<BR>
Expedition to the Barrier peaks, and probably some others. I'm not sure that<BR>
it would be the same without the divine works of some of the earlier TSR<BR>
artists, specifically Erol "Ool" Otus.<BR>
<BR>
It was a fantastic idea, and it worked really well with those two modules in<BR>
particular. Then again, Tomb of Horrors is my favorite adventure of all<BR>
time, although the sheer coolness of Expedition to the Barrier Peaks should<BR>
not be underestimated.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 08:57:26 +1100<BR>
From: "Jim & Peta Lawrie" <jimpeta@primus.com.au><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller News Service<BR>
<BR>
>Since the aging rolls at TL 12 begin at something like 110, and aganthetic<BR>
>drugs are available, I suppose all those guys in Sol Sector might be<BR>
>clearing their throats about now.<BR>
>Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
<BR>
    Which supplement or rules set was this aging table by tech level in? Is<BR>
it available on the net? One of my players is a Biologist and he's<BR>
constantly threatening an update on Biology, Genetics, Medicine et al for<BR>
the various games we play.<BR>
    Jim L. (MegaTraveller GM and proud of it.)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 14:09:08 -0800 (PST)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller News Service<BR>
<BR>
Jim & Peta Lawrie writes:<BR>
> <BR>
> >Since the aging rolls at TL 12 begin at something like 110, and aganthetic<BR>
> >drugs are available, I suppose all those guys in Sol Sector might be<BR>
> >clearing their throats about now.<BR>
> >Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>
> <BR>
>     Which supplement or rules set was this aging table by tech level in? Is<BR>
> it available on the net? One of my players is a Biologist and he's<BR>
> constantly threatening an update on Biology, Genetics, Medicine et al for<BR>
> the various games we play.<BR>
<BR>
This is GURPS.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 12 Dec 1999 11:43:55 -0500<BR>
From: Robert Prior <robert_prior@sympatico.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Wearable Lawyers (was Re: Deserts)<BR>
<BR>
>>- -40 is just a bit chilly. When I was a lad in Saskatoon I just threw on<BR>
>>another lawyer of clothing and skied to school.<BR>
>><BR>
><BR>
> and just how good are lawyers at insulating against windchill?<BR>
<BR>
And here I was thinking that no one had noticed that typo...<BR>
<BR>
I suspect they're work fine if you made them into a nice dense felt.<BR>
<BR>
(Anyone else remember the Kids in the Hall sketch about the trappers on Bay<BR>
Street?)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Sun, 12 Dec 1999 11:49:17 -0500<BR>
From: Robert Prior <robert_prior@sympatico.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Deserts<BR>
<BR>
>At 22:12 -0500 11/12/99, Cynthia Higginbotham <cyhiggin@pipeline.com> wrote:<BR>
>> > >(My definition of "pretty f*****g cold": when it gets down to -40, as it<BR>
>> > >usually does at least once during the winter up here. That's *really*<BR>
>> > >f*****g cold!)<BR>
>> ><BR>
>> > -40 is just a bit chilly. When I was a lad in Saskatoon I just threw on<BR>
>> > another lawyer of clothing and skied to school. No problem as long as you<BR>
>> > dress and behave appropriately. Now -60 is cold.<BR>
>>Here in N'Awlins, people start whining about the cold and wearing<BR>
>>coats when it gets below +50F. I grew up in Michigan, and spent<BR>
>>several years in Connecticut--to me, that's still T-shirt weather.<BR>
>>(Yes, I know what all you people from Minnesota and parts north<BR>
>>are going to say ;-)<BR>
><BR>
>Interesting - I feel like a NASA Mars probe as until the last two<BR>
>posts in this I've been assuming that the thread was talking Celcius.<BR>
><BR>
>Dom<BR>
<BR>
I was talking Celcius, they were (I assume) talking Fahrenheit. When in<BR>
doubt, assume an American domain uses American units.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 17:18:28 EST<BR>
From: GaryBartz@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller News Service<BR>
<BR>
In a message dated 12/13/99 4:45:30 PM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>
owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com writes:<BR>
<BR>
<< > Was Norris Duke during the Fourth War?<BR>
 <BR>
 Nope.  I did a background on Norris for a campaign in progress, as one of<BR>
 the characters crossed paths with him in Naval Intelligence School.  He <BR>
 becomes Duke of Regina in 1098.  In 1082, he was 18 years old; IMTU, he<BR>
 did not attend the Naval Academy, but was a "90-day wonder" and served as<BR>
 a junior officer in the Imperial Navy during the 4FW.  It just seemed to<BR>
 fit the character better.  :)<BR>
 <BR>
 His older brother, Willam, died in 1097.  IMTU, I invented a younger sister<BR>
 as the mother of his nephew, Count Audine Garhik (Marquis Vincennes).  <BR>
 <BR>
   -- Steve Bonneville  <BR>
  >><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
How do you guys run the academy? In my last universe there were little bases <BR>
and big big bases with the service schools and supply warehouses and such [in <BR>
addition to depots]...but I never got around to the academy. Is there one in <BR>
every sector/subsector? Why or why not? Is there a big one at capital for the <BR>
nobles and the talented commonors?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 17:28:54 -0500<BR>
From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Salvage<BR>
<BR>
From: Terry Carlino <carlino@home.com><BR>
<BR>
<BR>
> It was a great show. He was obviously an engineer and his "junk<BR>
>yard" included surplus military vehicles and such. It wasn't like he<BR>
>was using old Chevies.<BR>
<BR>
I would think it would be better if the cast were actually using old<BR>
Chevies.<BR>
<BR>
Chevy Novas, preferably! ;)<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 14:11:23 -0800 (PST)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Deserts (getting very OT)<BR>
<BR>
>From: Cynthia Higginbotham <cyhiggin@pipeline.com><BR>
<BR>
>Here in N'Awlins, people start whining about the cold<BR>
<BR>
>and wearing coats when it gets below +50F. I grew up <BR>
>in Michigan, and spent several years in Connecticut--<BR>
>to me, that's still T-shirt weather.<BR>
<BR>
As long as we're telling weather habituation stories,<BR>
let's not forget my college classmates who came from<BR>
Ghana and Nigeria and were suddenly confronted with<BR>
their first Pennsylvania autumn -- "how can you stand<BR>
this horrible cold?" they asked, as the temperature<BR>
hovered around 60F.  They were wearing down jackets in<BR>
September.  I don't know how they survived December<BR>
and January. <BR>
<BR>
By sophomore year, however, they were handling it<BR>
pretty well.  <BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Thousands of Stores.  Millions of Products.  All in one place.<BR>
Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 16:53:06 -0600<BR>
From: Eris reddoch <eris@pcola.gulf.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Deserts<BR>
<BR>
Phil Kitching wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >OTOH, we *do* need a couple of days below freezing to hold down the<BR>
> >mosquitos.  Oh, let's say, a Wednesday and Thursday in the middle of<BR>
> >January.  <g><BR>
 <BR>
> Why not a Saturday and Sunday, so you can avoid them with a long<BR>
> weekend break?<BR>
<BR>
Who wants to waste a weekend huddled around the stove? Better to do it<BR>
in the middle of the week when there's nothing but work to get in the<BR>
way anyway. <g><BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
    weekends are for the beach!<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 16:54:04 -0600<BR>
From: Eris reddoch <eris@pcola.gulf.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Deserts<BR>
<BR>
Ian Ferguson wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> Eris Reddoch writes:<BR>
> <snipped><BR>
> >Eris, who can count the times he's seen snow on the fingers of one hand<BR>
> <BR>
>         I hate Christmas without snow!  :(<BR>
<BR>
Will white sand do? ;-p<BR>
<BR>
Eris<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 17:00:59 -0600<BR>
From: Dan Roseberry <rosebee@troi.csw.net><BR>
Subject: RE:  GURPS Aliens (not GT Alien Races) in Traveller<BR>
<BR>
 >>Jeff Zeitlin writes:<BR>
> >I'd be interested in seeing various listmembers critiques of<BR>
> >GURPS Aliens, in the context of using them in Traveller.<BR>
Anthony Jackson writes:<BR>
> *Kronin: basically a minor human race with a weird society.  Could be<BR>
placed by<BR>
 >themselves on a redzoned world.<BR>
I was thinking of a Zhodani client state. Either way works though.<BR>
>*Pachekki: fine minor race.<BR>
Think the K'kree will like them? Think they'll like the K'kree? <eg><BR>
>*Traders: the sort of thing which would be likely to be a huge issue<BR>
once it<BR>
 >showed up.  If I were using them I'd probably have them appear _only_<BR>
in<BR>
 >J-space (and replace their vulnerability to metal with a dependency on<BR>
<BR>
 >J-space).  Having giant trading ships suddenly enter your jump<BR>
envelope and<BR>
 >start trading would be amusing...<BR>
How bout a Trader showing up on a Hiver Embassy ship? Try to explain to<BR>
a<BR>
Trader the concept of "capitalistic communism"  hoo hoo hooooo....<BR>
>*Kaa: the Kaa personality is not suited to a minor race.  To really use<BR>
them as<BR>
 >they are written up in G:Aliens they should be a major race with<BR>
territory<BR>
 >comparable to other major races.  With minor adjustments they could be<BR>
a minor<BR>
 >hostile state on the boarders of the Imperium.<BR>
These guys would need some adjusting without changing the terrain of<BR>
known space.<BR>
I've thought about using them IMTU as part of the group of powers that<BR>
fight the 3I<BR>
in the 'general war'. Figure they have 1-2 dozen systems packed with<BR>
high population.<BR>
My problem has been where to put them....I want them reasonably close to<BR>
the SP<BR>
Marches, but I like alot of whats in and around there. So the best I can<BR>
think of is<BR>
towards the core either in the Vargr extents or on the other side of<BR>
them. Having them<BR>
take over K'kree space would be amusing, but I want them on the other<BR>
side of the<BR>
3I. Suggestions?<BR>
*Truul:  These guys could be used as a plot; grandfather could have<BR>
created them to<BR>
do some projects, and when he was finished, or got bored, or whatever,<BR>
the Truul<BR>
just died out. Thousands of centuries later, Dev Landrel finds them, and<BR>
decides their<BR>
the real ancients (!%!*!)<BR>
<BR>
I have'nt really thought too much one way or the other about the rest.<BR>
Dan Roseberry (plop101) Whatever....<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 10:14:51 +1000<BR>
From: dadams@parracity.nsw.gov.au<BR>
Subject: Jackie Chan can whip Virus any day.<BR>
<BR>
David Pulver wrote :<BR>
>>><BR>
No, it is A-ko, B-ko and C-ko. It's sort of like saying "Jane Doe".  In<BR>
addition, the title is a parody of (I think) a Jackie Chan movie.<BR>
<<<<BR>
<BR>
Project A. In Project A Part 2, Jackie returned the favour by introducing<BR>
himself and his cop friends as A,B,C and D.<BR>
<BR>
ObTRAV: Project A can be a great 'Custom Patrol' IN campaign. Corrupt and/or<BR>
inept Officers, Noble officers with little in common with the troops on the<BR>
ground, smuggling into a red zone, and lots of sensless violence.<BR>
<BR>
Darryl<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 18:20:12 -0500<BR>
From: "Terry Carlino" <carlino@home.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Mass communication, the nobility and epistemology (LONG)<BR>
<BR>
>>Any kid who tried that up here would immediately have their telephone<BR>
>>confiscated.<BR>
><BR>
>You're in Edmonton, right?<BR>
><BR>
>Here in Toronto, we have a "no cell phones and pagers" regulation. The<BR>
>school administration won't enforce it, because many of those phones are<BR>
>encouraged by parents.<BR>
<BR>
Definitely not a problem south of the boarder.  Here in the States (at least<BR>
in my state) a pager or cell phone in school is an instant suspension, just<BR>
like a weapon. They've carried it to major extremes of ridiculousness, (as<BR>
is always done by bureaucracies.). Which means you can't even leave your<BR>
pager in your car on school property, or have a car installed cell phone<BR>
without getting into trouble. (I won't even go into the two honor students<BR>
that were expelled for weapons and drugs, one had a pair of scissors in her<BR>
purse, the other an aspirin.)<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav: How well are your PC's prepared to be cavity searched when they find<BR>
that carrying a Swiss army knife (I call'em Solomani pocket tools IMTU) is<BR>
illegal inside the local government building, where they have to go to get<BR>
their trading permit. Suddenly all those really neat gizmos the ex-scout<BR>
carries in her vest become major liabilities. Especially when it's explained<BR>
to them that all of the signs, clearly  posted and written in the local<BR>
lingo - variant Tagalog, say that such devices are prohibited. Of course<BR>
anyone can tell you that it would be fair to try to fine or imprison the<BR>
PC's since they couldn't read the signs. After all everyone knows<BR>
bureaucracies are fair. :)<BR>
<BR>
Terry C<BR>
All that is Gold does not glitter<BR>
Not all who travel are lost<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 10:18:02 +1000<BR>
From: dadams@parracity.nsw.gov.au<BR>
Subject: Christmas and snow.<BR>
<BR>
Doug Berry wrote :<BR>
>>><BR>
At 11:03 AM 12/13/1999 -0500, you wrote:<BR>
>Eris Reddoch writes:<BR>
><snipped><BR>
>>Eris, who can count the times he's seen snow on the fingers of one hand<BR>
><BR>
>    I hate Christmas without snow!  :(<BR>
<BR>
During the drive to and from Oregon this weekend, we encountered snow.  I<BR>
remembered why I like keeping it at safe distances.<BR>
<<<<BR>
<BR>
Wimps the lot of ya! Its not christmas without heatstroke! Then again, it never<BR>
snows here in Sydney during winter, so what chance have we got for a white<BR>
christmas?<BR>
<BR>
ObTRAV: A culteral event from one world is celebrated on another world, with<BR>
stange/funny results. example , running naked in a Tainted asmposhere or<BR>
whatever.<BR>
<BR>
Darryl<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 15:36:41 -0800 (PST)<BR>
From: Kiri Aradia Morgan <tiamat@tsoft.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Mass communication, the nobility and epistemology (LONG)<BR>
<BR>
On Mon, 13 Dec 1999, Terry Carlino wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Definitely not a problem south of the boarder.  Here in the States (at least<BR>
> in my state) a pager or cell phone in school is an instant suspension, just<BR>
> like a weapon. They've carried it to major extremes of ridiculousness, (as<BR>
> is always done by bureaucracies.). Which means you can't even leave your<BR>
> pager in your car on school property, or have a car installed cell phone<BR>
> without getting into trouble. (I won't even go into the two honor students<BR>
> that were expelled for weapons and drugs, one had a pair of scissors in her<BR>
> purse, the other an aspirin.)<BR>
> <BR>
Not in California-- I see kids walking in and out of schools with<BR>
cellphones and pagers all the time.<BR>
<BR>
But I myself was not permitted entry into an amusement park (Great<BR>
America) until I walked all the way back to my then-husband's car with our<BR>
keychains, removed the mini-knockoff Swiss Army knives, the longest blades<BR>
upon which were 1.5" long, and locked them in the car.  A folding knife<BR>
with a 1.5" blade was considered a weapon, despite the fact that it's<BR>
really no good for anything other than cutting tape on boxes and slitting<BR>
open envelopes, etc.<BR>
<BR>
LOL,<BR>
Kiri<BR>
<BR>
******************************************************************************<BR>
Kiri Aradia Morgan                                  93!  Thou Art God<BR>
tiamat@tsoft.com<BR>
<BR>
"If time passes, everything turns into beauty<BR>
If the rains stop, tears clean the scars of memory away<BR>
Everything starts wearing fresh colors<BR>
Every sound begins playing a heartfelt melody<BR>
Jealousy embellishes a page of the epic<BR>
Desire is embraced in a dream..."              -- X-JAPAN <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 15:38:50 -0800 (PST)<BR>
From: Kiri Aradia Morgan <tiamat@tsoft.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Deserts<BR>
<BR>
On Mon, 13 Dec 1999, Eris reddoch wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Ian Ferguson wrote:<BR>
> > <BR>
> > Eris Reddoch writes:<BR>
> > <snipped><BR>
> > >Eris, who can count the times he's seen snow on the fingers of one hand<BR>
> > <BR>
> >         I hate Christmas without snow!  :(<BR>
> <BR>
> Will white sand do? ;-p<BR>
> <BR>
The nice thing about living in places where it doesn't snow is that if you<BR>
really want to see snow, you can go where the snow is, look at it, enjoy<BR>
it, and leave.<BR>
<BR>
I personally do not want to see snow at any time other than the morning of<BR>
December 25th.  I certainly do not want to see it on the nights of 12/24<BR>
or worse yet, 12/31, when people are enough of a danger to themselves on<BR>
the roads.<BR>
<BR>
Kiri<BR>
<BR>
******************************************************************************<BR>
Kiri Aradia Morgan                                  93!  Thou Art God<BR>
tiamat@tsoft.com<BR>
<BR>
"If time passes, everything turns into beauty<BR>
If the rains stop, tears clean the scars of memory away<BR>
Everything starts wearing fresh colors<BR>
Every sound begins playing a heartfelt melody<BR>
Jealousy embellishes a page of the epic<BR>
Desire is embraced in a dream..."              -- X-JAPAN <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 18:41:20 -0500<BR>
From: "Josh W. Spencer" <macmanjws@earthlink.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Mass communication, the nobility and epistemology (LONG)<BR>
<BR>
On 12/13/1999 18:20, Terry Carlino wrote:<BR>
><BR>
> Definitely not a problem south of the boarder.  Here in the States (at least<BR>
> in my state) a pager or cell phone in school is an instant suspension, just<BR>
> like a weapon. They've carried it to major extremes of ridiculousness, (as<BR>
> is always done by bureaucracies.). Which means you can't even leave your<BR>
> pager in your car on school property, or have a car installed cell phone<BR>
> without getting into trouble. (I won't even go into the two honor students<BR>
> that were expelled for weapons and drugs, one had a pair of scissors in her<BR>
> purse, the other an aspirin.)<BR>
Good Lord...what state might that be...Illinois?<BR>
> <BR>
> ObTrav: How well are your PC's prepared to be cavity searched when they find<BR>
> that carrying a Swiss army knife (I call'em Solomani pocket tools IMTU) is<BR>
> illegal inside the local government building, where they have to go to get<BR>
> their trading permit. Suddenly all those really neat gizmos the ex-scout<BR>
> carries in her vest become major liabilities. Especially when it's explained<BR>
> to them that all of the signs, clearly  posted and written in the local<BR>
> lingo - variant Tagalog, say that such devices are prohibited. Of course<BR>
> anyone can tell you that it would be fair to try to fine or imprison the<BR>
> PC's since they couldn't read the signs. After all everyone knows<BR>
> bureaucracies are fair. :)<BR>
Is there a little shop where they could "deposit" their Solomani Pocket<BR>
Tools (HEY! I LOVE that designation) prior to entering the local government<BR>
building? The task to find one better be difficult, unless one of the PC's<BR>
knows something about Tagalog, in which case it'd be routine. ;) :)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Josh<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 1999 11:03:18 +1000<BR>
From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>
Subject: Re: Nobility<BR>
<BR>
Dear Folks -<BR>
<BR>
William wrote:<BR>
>>   There is an interesting article in one of the Traveller Chronicle <10 by<BR>
>>Andy Slack(?)  dealing with the extension of social standing from A-Z that<BR>
>>way filling plenty of room for lots of noble ranks.  It is really a first<BR>
>>class piece of writing.<BR>
><BR>
>It also totally changes the feel of the setting (I've tried it). I'd<BR>
>suggest avoiding it... but it is wonderfully written. It also is not<BR>
>supportive of existing canon. Great for Heresy, though.<BR>
<BR>
There has been a few discussions of Nobility on this list, and the subject of<BR>
how you organise noble titles with a vast population of nobles has arisen<BR>
before. There seem to be two main options proposed:<BR>
     1. Increase the number of noble ranks past "F";<BR>
     2. Distinguish between local nobility and Imperial nobility.<BR>
<BR>
I'd call the first option the the quick and dirty approach. It may work, but has<BR>
drawbacks - mainly due to its simplicity. The second option, I think is the<BR>
better - and more canonical - one.<BR>
<BR>
Note that the term "local nobility" can be confusing. Here's the canon (boom!):<BR>
"Local nobility represents the Imperium in systems not administered by high<BR>
nobility. These nobles make up the majority of the Imperial nobility, and<BR>
although they are only equivalent to barons and knights in precedence, they are<BR>
hereditary members of the peerage."<BR>
<BR>
This allows the second option to be drawn out a number of interesting ways.<BR>
First, the local nobility can have local titles that sound more impressive (ie.<BR>
higher in precedence) than their Imperial title. Heaven forbid if you address<BR>
them by the "lower" Imperial title in the context of their own local<BR>
jurisdiction - and conversely, you would never find them officially addressed as<BR>
anything other than their Imperial title when off-world (or at least out of<BR>
their local context).<BR>
<BR>
If you are worried that this makes the Imperial bureaucracy look too telescoped<BR>
together, think of it like this: Cleon _imposed_ this system on the Sylean<BR>
Federation. He is portrayed as being a canny politician, so you could suppose<BR>
that he made up a system that is simple enough to keep track of (ie. has only a<BR>
few levels), but has complicated-enough qualification rules that keep the new<BR>
(and intendent) nobility quarrelling about their comparative status rather than<BR>
seriously vying for the Throne itself.<BR>
<BR>
What you can also suppose is that extra-Imperial worlds used to have local<BR>
nobility or rulers with fanciful titles ("tzar", "emir", "king", "potentate",<BR>
etc etc). When these worlds were integrated into the Imperium, the local ruler<BR>
was either given a place in the high nobility with an imperial title (such as<BR>
Marquis, the ruler of a single world), or simply retain their local title but<BR>
are only considered - in Imperial precedence - as equal to an Imperial Baron.<BR>
The only local title that the Imperium would frown upon keeping is that of<BR>
"emperor" (a bit like the army captain being brevetted to "Major" aboard a naval<BR>
vessel - you can only have _one_ of those aboard ship, y'know... ;-)<BR>
<BR>
This enables you to have a universe which, like reality, is not cut-and-dried.<BR>
Entire campaigns could revolve around proving that one local noble line should<BR>
be granted Imperial stature, or hunting down the correct lineage of a noble<BR>
family, or performing such tasks for a noble patron that are designed at raising<BR>
their Imperial precedence.<BR>
<BR>
There you go, Loren! Three adventure seeds for the new book! ;-)<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson        Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>
http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw                       davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>
"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material & opinions contained within are solely those<BR>
of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>
position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 1999 16:13:36 -0800 (PST)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re:  GURPS Aliens (not GT Alien Races) in Traveller<BR>
<BR>
Dan Roseberry writes:<BR>
<BR>
> > *Kronin: basically a minor human race with a weird society.  Could be<BR>
> placed by<BR>
>  >themselves on a redzoned world.<BR>
> I was thinking of a Zhodani client state. Either way works though.<BR>
<BR>
I think the Zho would think the Kronin were nutcases, and would make an effort to 'fix 'them.<BR>
<BR>
> >*Pachekki: fine minor race.<BR>
> Think the K'kree will like them? Think they'll like the K'kree? <eg><BR>
Hm...I don't recall there being any reason for the K'kree to object to them.<BR>
<BR>
> >*Traders: the sort of thing which would be likely to be a huge issue<BR>
> once it<BR>
>  >showed up.  If I were using them I'd probably have them appear _only_<BR>
> in<BR>
>  >J-space (and replace their vulnerability to metal with a dependency on<BR>
> <BR>
>  >J-space).  Having giant trading ships suddenly enter your jump<BR>
> envelope and<BR>
>  >start trading would be amusing...<BR>
> How bout a Trader showing up on a Hiver Embassy ship? Try to explain to<BR>
> a<BR>
> Trader the concept of "capitalistic communism"  hoo hoo hooooo....<BR>
Well, I suspect the Trader would be interested.  They aren't precisely capitalists anyway.<BR>
<BR>
> >*Kaa: the Kaa personality is not suited to a minor race.  To really use<BR>
> them as<BR>
>  >they are written up in G:Aliens they should be a major race with<BR>
> territory<BR>
>  >comparable to other major races.  With minor adjustments they could be<BR>
> a minor<BR>
>  >hostile state on the boarders of the Imperium.<BR>
> These guys would need some adjusting without changing the terrain of<BR>
> known space.<BR>
> I've thought about using them IMTU as part of the group of powers that<BR>
> fight the 3I<BR>
> in the 'general war'. Figure they have 1-2 dozen systems packed with<BR>
> high population.<BR>
> My problem has been where to put them....I want them reasonably close to<BR>
> the SP<BR>
> Marches, but I like alot of whats in and around there. So the best I can<BR>
> think of is<BR>
> towards the core either in the Vargr extents or on the other side of<BR>
> them. Having them<BR>
> take over K'kree space would be amusing, but I want them on the other<BR>
> side of the<BR>
> 3I. Suggestions?<BR>
<BR>
Well, I figured I could make them into a client race of the Markaan, and give them a jump gate into some world in a convenient location, with their true homeworld way beyond the Imperium.  This allows them to have military forces completely out of proportion to their apparent size.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #1488<BR>
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